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Sohn Seung-yeon – “저 달이 지면” (When that moon sets) [ Download ]
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here ! :-)
Hi mia! Happy Friday ; )
hi mia! you sound surprised at being first. happy friday and OT to you.
and errrr. .. happy chinese new year too! hahah
yippii, just when I arrived back from jogging and looked in my mailbox I had a postcard from South Korea there! I am part of the Postcrossing activity.... my first south korean card
I am still thinking about hidden personalities and peoples´ personal history. also in the context of the world and other people. we have our own lives and desires, do we want to be a part of someone elses´ story or do we hide away in our own world?
and how much the big picture, the grand ignores the individuals. that is why I like dramas: they are about different individuals not some great narratives. well, except sageuks. but even those concentrate on opening up the people behind the titles not just retell history
here be the card
The postcard is intriguing - what is postcrossing activity anyhoot?
Long time no see.
Just finished some work and have a bit of time before picking the kids up from school.
Dramawise, not much time for actual watching. Collecting data :--) and watching in chunks. So far like the Flower Boys the best. Though Jo In Sung still waits for a close inspection ;--)
Went to J-dramas when I was sick last week.
Managed to marathon Love Shuffle (liked the first round more than the second one, loved Usami and Airu) and first season of Hana Yori Dango (yes, I was feeling really sick :--) ). I think from all 3 versions this is the best one.
Started Nobunaga no Chef. Wished all conflicts could be solved by good cooking.
Last weekend I went to a book fair and bought by random choice 2 volumes of the Wallflower manga serie. Had big laugh. The 2 random picks were really funny. Then I found out that they even made it into a drama. Watched 1st episode, but so far it has a different vibe... or did I by chance manage to choose the only funny volumes?
Anyway, nice weekend to all!
hi dorotka! hope you have a nice weekend too :)
Hi Dorotka! Long time no see!
I definitely prefer JIS drama to Flower Boys (which I only read in recaps while commuting). But I am not as much a JIS fan as Bummie's. Love him switching from the cutie mode into furious mode. He did the same in Padam Padam and that's what I love him for. No, I don't care about his face or whatever ;p
Have a lovely weekend!
I haven't seen any episode from TWTWB yet. I don't watch melos too often... but JIS got me in WHIB and I can't forget him. Will defenitely watch couple of episodes because of him... and then see if I will be able to bear the melo-pain further...
Prety Neighbours are nice to watch and I like the main trio. Though I do admit that for me this one is the weakest from the 3 - perhaps because the side characters are sometimes very poorly written (Watanabe??)...
As for the first 5 episodes you can watch them, they are practically painless :). I am not a great fan of melos, but if they are well done, they are good - this one seems ok.
Collecting data is such a bad phrase for me right now. I start panicking whenever I hear it.
The right conclusions can be only done with the right data :--) Looking forward to my JIS analysis... ;--)
Czesc, tez sie dolacze!
I'm really liking Nobunaga no Chef. Used to be a total Iron Chef junkie, and this also adds history, another favorite. I appreciate how educational this show is trying to be.
Hej! Milo Cie widziec/czytac :)
I don't really like cooking dramas, but this one seems very popular here on OT. Is it very food-centric? I mean is there lots of nitpicking and bitching over food because it is not "as it should be" or do they simply show the process of preparing meals? I can't stand to watch where they throw food away just because there is one grain of pepper too much or something. The only drama of the kind I enjoyed was Fermentation Family, but I don't mind expanding my horizons!
I've just seen 2 episodes... but so far nothing like that :--) Definitely no wasted food (everybody is hungry).
The main hero time-jumps to past times and is more trying to save his life by excellent cooking (and win some political battles for his lord Nobunaga). He lost his memory and doesn't remember anything but his cooking skills. He also has a lovely helper Natsu (a woman smith pretending to be a man). Just try it and you will see if it fits your taste :--)
I have seen first 2 episodes so far and like it. The historical parts as well. Though I'm horrible at history and usually forget everything in 10 minutes...
Hello beanies! Have a nice Friday!
It is quite cold and cloudy here. I hope spring comes soon. Of course I also like the winter: Throw
snowballs and laughing children, skiing in the snowy woods, great snowy landscape .... But something like
this does not exist in the city. Everything is gray and mushy. People are cold. Everywhere, people
coughing and sneezing. And they have a bad temper.
I will not even watch Horeshealer until the end. There are also only sick people. ((Horesehealer: if you keep a lot of work, then your girlfriend will run away!!!) Anyway. I watch the remaining episodes later in a row.
Hope the weather will get better soon in KDramaland. I want a drama with a beautiful beach, blue water,
nice weather and pretty athletic people. The play volleyball and swim... And you can see a lot of triceps
and ABS etc..
I think, do I need the name of the nearest hotel to that beach, so that I can book my holidays right away.
Hi Swurbel! A happy Friday to you too!
It's so cold here too! I can't even take a walk outside without my head feeling like it's about to come off from the freezing wind, brr. I wouldn't mind some sunshine, even if it's just a little to release everyone from their bad temper and coughing as you said! A holiday on a sunny beach wouldn't be too bad either...
FishcalledWanda!! You speak to me from the heart!
(...I know, it sounds a little strange, but I don't know the correct english idiom at the moment... :-( ) But I hope, you know what I mean.
I know what you mean! Don't know if it's a correct expression in English (also not my mother language), but I do like it : ) Ah, I want to feel the sun on my face. It shone a little today while snowflakes were falling, a bit of a surreal experience that was.
Reading your wish about a drama with beautiful beach, blue water, etc, I think I'm going to search Haeundae Lovers in my hard disk. Cause this drama fits your wish (with Kim Kang Wook abs and triceps too)
Hello Dewo! Thanks for the note. I know Haeundae Lovers. But one Kim Kang Wook is not enough. He needs partners for the beachvolleyballplay.
Maybe Lee Min Ho, Kim Bum, Jung Suk Won, Bang Sung Joon and Yoo Seung Ho. that would be a fine flowerboy-beachvolleyball-competition!! Can't wait, to watch it!!
Sigh...(...nice daydream is over...)
poor swurbel and wanda - wish i could send you all some of our heat and sun. we have rain almost everyday but generally we are never cold except indoors!! abuse of airconditioning in public places here.
if its any comfort, there are not many pretty people on the beaches normally. just very ordinary looking ones haha.
i quite like watching the winter dramas coz everyone generally dresses so well - i have no clue how to dress for cold countries. i can only try to look nice in the tropics coz i dont know the art of layering.
in any case, i do hope the weather starts improving soon for you all although i seem to have said this in the last one month on every OT!!
have a great weekend everyone, despite the cold.
Haha thanks enz! I wish you could pack some sunshine in a box and send it to the colder regions of the world! But rain everyday can't be very nice too.
I agree with you that everyone looks so nice in winter dramas! The scarfs and hats and winter coats all look so comfy! Dressing with layers a skill indeed! I wish I could look so fashionable while freezing all over!
Have a nice Friday! : )
wanda, our rain is torrential when it comes but usually over in an hour but may cause massive jams on the road :(
have you been using some of the recipes that we all posted last time?
That's not so good, I hate traffic jams (they always make me feel carsick)! But luckily the rain doesn't last too long. It's weird to imagine that here it's freezing, but on some other part of the world the sun's shining!
Yes I did! Some of them made it to my list of regular meals, one of which being your pasta recipe! I really love pasta, but my mom always made a vegetarian version, so I wouldn't have thought of it myself to add sausage. But I'm glad you suggested it, cause it tastes very good! Oh and your cookie recipe was also very good! I also tried making a cheese cake the other day, but that one didn't turn out so well. I don't know what I did wrong, but in the end it was all flubby and weird, hehe.
What dramas have you been enjoying lately? Watched any other dramas with Jung Il Woo in it? ; )
oohh, happy to hear that youre still making that pasta. i am thinking of doing that this saturday as i will be having guests over.
i am watching FBND and L7 as the currents and then recently i watched THE WOman who still wants to marry coz i wanted to see why everyone is so goo goo ga ga over kim bum. i really enjoyed TWWSWTM. its still on my mind a week later so i must have liked it more than i thought when i was watching it. have you watched that one??
i am not loving the currents as much as most seem to.. i dont find enrique cute. the story and the characters dont grab my heart i am sad to say. i was anticipating this drama so much coz of my love for both FBRS and SUFBB. oh well..
i really miss seeing jung il woo onscreen - sung joon too but at least i watched sung joon recently on Can We get Married. Il Woo hasnt been in anything new for a while. I do know that he is in Myanmar to promote holika holika. am looking forward to someone posting his pics on tumblr :) poor deprived me. haha
honestly, at the moment I would also take a normal beach with normal people. The main thing: no grey snowmud and cold wet wind!
Envy you for your warm weather!
Cold at my place as well. Espicially the wind. Missing the warmth... Wouldn't mind some beach and sun either... with or without people...or abs... who cares... just bring the warm sand!
...so... I ended up relaxing on the floor in our bathroom... it has the floorheating... :--)
:-) I would also like to do that. But my cat likes the underfloor heating too. And kitty do not want to share that warm place...
Was watching Rascal Sons and it seems as though Inok's first love (Kang Hee's husband) threatens to take her child Dabin. He abandoned her when she fell pregnant and was never involved in the child's upbringing. Now, my question is, does Korean law allow that? I mean taking the child - just because he fathered him.
(He didn't know at the time he left that she was pregnant with his child.)
I and others have pointed out a few times in these forums that K-drama is not a good place to get your legal education on Korean laws :D
Hey everyone!! Hope you have a great week <3
I've got my first performance in a play tonight so... hopefully it all goes well!!!
Hi Leaf! Wishing you a great week too!
Ooh, exciting! Don't be too nervous, it'll go great! Good luck tonight : ) What play are you performing? And do you have a big role?
Break a leg Leaf! I love the theatre!
oh wow leaf! good luck. do well. fighting!!
Yeah Leaf, way to go! Break a leg!
Leaf! How are you, kiddo. (I haven't been on much). Congrats on the play, I'm sure you'll be awesome!
Break a leg Leaf! I hope you have a good time on stage :)
And don't forget to share your impressions afterwards!
Good luck, Leaf! Where are you performing?
Knock 'em dead, and maybe there will be a cute Korean guy in the audience who will be smitten!! ;)
Shukie-ssi! I wondered when you would be arriving on here!
Today had it's own melo track - a trip to the local treasurer's office followed by a trip to the DMV for my address change. So I'm a bit behind on OT. But I still try to get up here once or twice during the weekend!
I think my first post ended up in the late 30's somewhere downthread. It's also a victim of the mobile phone, which takes a lot longer to type out.
break a leg, leaf! =)
Break a leg, Leaf!! You'll be awesome! :D
Now I know why tonight its so hard for me to open dramabeans, cause its OT's time.
Hello every one.
It's already bedtime for my children. So I can crave my kdrama obsession here with you guys.
A gentlemen's dignity
Can we get married
Nice guy (stuck in episode 7)
Level 7 civil servant grade
Flower boy next door
That winter the wind blows
That's quite the lineup! I'm dabbling in so many dramas cause I have MY dramas that I'm watching and the dramas I'm watching with my sister (a new convert!)
Flower Boy Next Door
King of Dramas
Can We Get Married
With my sister:
And then I have a few recapping dramas on the backburner: Padam Padam, White Christmas, How to Meet a Perfect Neighbor
AND I'm watchign White Christmas with my best friend AND her husband. How's that for victory?
Well, if you convert your sister, for me it was my sister who converted me into k drama addict. And I've read your unfinished recap of how to meet a perfect neighbour. I hope you can finished it. Fighting!
Okay, well since you asked, I'll do a HTMAPN next!
I've converted my sister, my mom, my bestfriend and although they're not converts, my dad has watched City Hunter and White Christmas and my friend's husband is watching White Christmas...so at least they're watching, right?
In terms of converts, zgznoona converted me to team Arashi...she came for a visit and...well, I wrote a blog post on her nefarious reasons for visiting and ALL of them have to do with Nino...
Dewo, I converted my sister and now we've converted my 89 year old mother. She doesn't have internet, so she told me she's saving her pennies to buy DVDs to go with the ones we've already bought her. My 89 yr old Mom has stayed up until 3:30 a.m. to watch a drama. How crazy is that?
Raine, I tried to start White Christmas last night as everyone said how fabulous it is, but I guess I kept dozing off. I think it's something I need to watch while fully awake, not at 2 a.m.! Also, I'm not good with creepy things, so this may be a morning watch, haha!
Korazy Lady - The first episode is slower paced and you do need to focus. It's not creepy. You can watch at night. But yeah, be awake. You need to catch as many details as possible! Or just sit and observe how gorgeous the camerawork is!
Thanks for the tips. I just keep seeing snow and dark hallways when I'd wake up, and when I'd try to rewind I couldn't figure out where I'd left off. I have it all downloaded so will try again tonight.
Watched White Christmas last year -- amazing series, need to watch it again.
From that list, I liked CWGM the most.
From AGD...only the opening 5min of each episode...
Kids in beds as well :--)
Good Morning Fellow Beanies! Hope this day finds you all well.
Right now I am obsessed with Queen of Ambition. It is one of the best dramas I've ever watched. Can't wait for the next episode!
Also watching A Hundred Years Inheritance and Flower Boy Next Door. I dropped Level 7 Civil Servant so am looking for a replacement. Will be interested to see you Beanies' suggestions!
I know, I have to start QoA just for you. Heh.
Morning Korazy Lady!
So I never got past episode 3 of Queen of Ambition. I really want to watch but I got nervous at how dark it was starting to go. How is my Yunho doing? I haven't heard any talk about his acting being bad yet, and found him to be respectable in episodes he was in. You are making me want to watch again. Not sure if I can handle her treachery though...
Yes, it IS dark. I almost dropped it at one point as it was so upsetting. BUT am so glad I didn't. It is so well written and well acted. Yunho is doing a great job altho not much is asked of his character compared to the others.
I think it's on episode 12 now and it keeps me on the edge of my seat. So much happens in each episode--I'll be dying waiting for next week's episodes to be subbed. You must try it! It's worth the pain when you get to the revenge part (of course I say that now, not knowing what is coming next, haha!)
Sold! or Call!
Will start again this weekend as I am in drama lull. Hopefully my poor heart will be able to take it. Also glad Yunho is doing well!
If you think QoA episode 3 was dark, wait til you see the rest of them :)
On the other hand, her list of really bad enemies is growing almost every day, so I think her downfall is getting pretty near.
our fave dramas overlap so i might have to check out QoA if you let us know that it is good till the end. although am not much of a melo fan.
arent you checking out that winter, the wind blows? i saw one episode and might check out more when i have the time.
i never seem to LOVE those that i simulcast as much as those i have marathoned when completed. i almost loved nice guy and reply 1997 but then that petered out too :(.
might have to change my drama watching habit to just completed dramas
I will be checking out That Winter, but am waiting for my sister to arrive next week. We will marathon the episodes available at that time. I can't wait (but I promised my sister I would, and you know you have to respect your unni!)
You should tell my sister that...
youre talking to someone who is someone's disrespectful younger sister! hehe
Enz- ha! my dongsaeng tortures me to make herself feel better!
i have no reason for torturing my eonni :)
Wanna be MY dongsaeng? *looks around for Lil Raine...*
Ok, it was kind of a lie - I'm more like the unni in the relationship. There's no torturing involved, but it's usually my way or the highway when it comes to sisterly things, haha! But that's because she's always relied on me to do all the hard stuff in life!
Dongsaeng for hire! You're on!! :)
It's more fun to be the brat anyway... ;)
QOA is good? Uhm..okay, i might give it a shot. Thanks. Not a k-drama but if you can deal with a sweet little romantic story, Shiawase ni narou yo is good.
Carol, QoA is so good, I may have to replace QSS as my favorite drama. And if you read these OT's regularly, (which I know you do), you know how much I LOVE QSS!
EEEKSSS!!! NOOOOO !!!! DONT SAY THAT WHEN pillowhead is not around to help me to hold onto you with QSS love!!
pillowhead, pillowhead!!! are you going to be here??
LOL! Ohjeeeeeeee! You guys have it bad! Okay, then. I'll watch it. Thanks.
lmao!!!! But did you read my rating of QSS on Kakashi's blog? You know the love is deep, really deep!
Actually Korazy, I'm not worried. It's really hard to beat the ending of QSS, which was just near perfect. So many dramas seem great until the last few episodes and just don't make that spot in the heart because of that.
Oh no! I am behind on QoA, but I just can't see how it can beat the magnificence of Eric in QSS!
Good heavens, All!
I'm watching the first episode. Wow!!! Major stuff in the first 15 minutes!!!! The horror at the beginning... avenger will be doomed whatever the outcome of that first scene, right? I hate when they show something like that at the beginning. Will continue looking.
I watch alternate episodes of QoA. It is an interesting story on the one hand so I keep watching, but on the other hand the main heroine is such a hateful character, that I can't watch more than one episode per week. And I don't want to be traumatised too much, so I skip episodes.
Whoever decided to put the word "ambition" into the title, upset me a whole lot. It's about greed and vanity. All heroes of underdog dramas should feel offended.
Are you reading recaps inbetween? Because I haven't found any, and I have no idea how you're following what is going on. There is so much happening now, I wouldn't want to miss a minute!
How am I following? I guess it's explained in flashbacks and in intros, so I get the main point. I think :D
To tell te truth, I just want the monster to be punished. Severely. And in original ways, like the ajumma did on her wedding day *malicious laughter*
SO MUCH WIN
Yeah, I gave up QofA after episode 7. That one was just too rough for me. I don't want to spoil anything, but I will say that all I hope for with that drama is the the supposed h of said drama pays and pays and pays for all the havoc she's wrecked on the people she has hurt and killed. As a mother, I just couldn't get past that episode.
That is the episode where I literally turned it off and walked away. I did not feel they needed to go there. But in a way, they did. So I had to come back to see the revenge for it. And apart from that incident, the story is soooo goooood.
I will say that I understood from a narrative perspective why the story went there. And it did succeed in making this h completely unredeamable and unrootable. All I'd be watching for is for the H to exact any and all revenge he could against her.
I am tempted to go back and see if she does get what's coming to her. But I don't know that I could stand to see even her small successes let alone any major ones. And I also worry that somehow the H will still love her.
Rashell, this is not Nice Guy. There will be NO LOVE for her from H. The writers couldn't go there. If you want, I'll catch up with you in the end and let you know if you'll be able to stomach the ending. I've had to do that with some. I wouldn't watch Beautiful Days until I knew the ending (of course, that was in the early kdrama days, maybe I'm tougher now :) )
@Korazy Lady: Ha, at your Nice Guy comment. That was an issue for me in that drama as well. But here it would be a dealbreaker. There is no way I could accept any love from the H for the h after ep 7. Just no way.
You're actualy tempting me to start watching again. I'm old enough that I can usually stomach about whatever, but as a mommy ep 7 was too much in that moment. But if the rest of the drama is about how to destroy that b!tch, then I think I wouldn't mind watching that. But do keep updating in the OT if you wouldn't mind. I'm currently obsessed with FBND and TWTWB, so finding time for another drama may be tough.
my heavens! you guys are totally turning me onto QoA. I must see this vicious woman's story. Thanks. (hoping i can deal with her "ambition."
@Carole McDonnell: Yeah, this lady is a prize. Probably the most selfish kdrama character ever. She really will sacrifice anything and anyone to advance her own agenda. Nothing is off the table for her. She's a complete and total narcisist. And I've only watched through ep 7. I can only imagine what havoc she's wrecked since. I would get so much satisfaction from seeing her crash and burn.
I think ep7 was the high point for the Queen, and the low point for everyone else in the drama, but ever since ep8 the "good guys" seem to be getting the upper hand, and she is getting more an more boxed into a corner. It is also making for some pretty unlikely alliances to bring about her downfall - "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".
I also did not watch for about 2 weeks after ep7 - but then I just had to start it up again to see how she gets drug through hell in the end.
I've forgotten something.
Watching L7Servant. Funny funny. Especially the parents. (Good people, but I'm glad, that my parents are not like that).
And finally I have also seen FBND. At first I was a little confused. I always thought that the man, who arrives at the airport at the beginning, does NOT get the girl - the normal fate of a 2nd-lead. (...but it seems, it is not a fixed rule in Kdramaland...).
I wish Jin-rak and Dok-mi would be a couple. But Enrique and Dok-mi together is also ok. (A threesome is probably too much (or early) for KDramaland????) Because Jin-rak has still Dong-hoon. :-)
And my favorite part so far was the suit fashion how!!!. Totally unnecessary for the story. But hey! :-) What the heck. Good looking hot men in fancy black suits - I love it!!!
I wish you a nice weekend!! Watch your health and do not catch a cold!!!
The fashion show in FBND was so awesome! I was totally cracking up while saying "WHY is this here?!" That whole part had me laughing my head off.
FBND did great with the clothes this week - first the obligatory Cinderella transformation for Dok-mi (and I actually enjoyed that+Enrique's goofing around more than the boys' fanservice) and then the SUITS!!!!!!!!! (though what I really appreciated there was Enrique's hair, it's nice to see him with a different style lol)
But yes, suit fashion show. It was awesomely cracky, if random. And I am not ready for it all to end next week, watching poor Enrique's face at the end of ep 14 was bad enough T____T
I know, and I especially loved the "What is that on your face?" in the recap. I was laughing so hard at Enrique's little gangsta patch.
Yes. Poor, poor Enrique!!!
And you know what? I was totally inspired by that suitshow and wanted to buy a new suit for my boyfriend (... it's a little scary how well product placement works sometimes). But my boyfriend did not feel like shopping. :-(
Talking about product placement. After seeing all the fine-looking Kdrama men in their suits I went out a bought my son a new suit.
It was $700 with alterations (we had a $500 coupon) and it is the nicest suit in his wardrobe.
I love the well dressed men in the kdrama world.
Totally agree, espec about Enrique's hair. I must be a hair person. (I'm generally a nose person who falls for guys with great noses...hence, Jung Il Woo.) But when I saw Enrique's hair...I thought he looked super-good and I could see his beauty way clearer than i did in other episodes when he was Mr. Moppet.
I especially liked when Dok Mi did her makeover. There was this look in Enrique's eyes when she came out looking all hot. I thought: wow, even though he loves her already...this is where he sees her sexually. Clothes do really affect men, don't they?
Loved the guys in their suits. And yeah, i did think: "And what is this about? And why is it here?" But i couldn't help but go along with such a wonderfully fun bromantic moment.
yeah, I totally get what you mean about the look in his eyes when she came out and modelled her dresses - and it was GOOD to see him look at her that way <3
The look and lip biting when she came out in the white dress - EPIC!!
Enrique can rock such a range of fashion--from panda suit to gangsta suit!
Hi everyone! Happy Friday to you all!
I'm wondering whether it'll be worthwhile watching ad genius. Has anyone started it??? Is it good? I'm not sure if I can bear watching poor kang-aaaahhh as only second lead. Why does he never end up happy?
I'm really enjoying it so far. I like the two main leads (still not sure about the second ones, though) and I like all the other tertiary characters. I like the drama that revolves around the underdog ad agency trying to make ads and grow--and find those characters endearing.
The two main leads I think have a nice, natural chemistry, and they start out developing a friendship, which is a nice change up from the love-hate-bicker-bicker relationships you often see. I would give it a try at least. They have now 6 episodes fully subbed on Viki.
ooh I think I like the idea that they develop a friendship first. I'll have to have a look :-)
Happy Friday, everyone! Snowed in, so that would mean I could watch dramas...but I have midterms to study for so mehhh.
I finished Secret Garden last week while I was sick...it kinda felt bipolar to me. It was hilarious, but then that dreaded scene in episode 13 happened and really turned me off of the show. I decided to keep going (I'd spent over 10 hours of my life on it, so why not finish it?) and sort of got back into it but then totally lost interest in episode 18 or so, so I just fast-forwarded a lot to the parts I wanted to watch. One thing I did love was the second leads; Seul was awesome towards the second half, and I really enjoyed Oska's character. I actually cared about them getting back together, whereas I was just kinda a spectator with Ra-im and Joo-won. It's an okay drama, I just don't understand the hype xD On to Best Love!
Flower Boy Next Door is finishing next week! I will probably shed a few tears when it goes...although I was pretty frustrated with this week's developments. It does seem out of character for Dok-mi to do something like that, and the teasers for episode 15 seemed like she intended it. But I have a teensy bit of hope that it was just an accident or something...although I have a lot more doubt. Seeing Enrique's face was awful! So let's hope that Dok-mi hurts a lot? Haha, just kidding (sorta)...I have a lot less desire for Do-hwi to be redeemed after the way that she acted in episode 14, just saying. I still think it would be possible if it were real life, but in two episodes...not so much.
Enjoy your day!
Hey - about Secret Garden, Asian dramas and their asshead heroes!
My alarm bells were ringing way before that 'bed scene.' What about the time he undresses her to see her wound, or forces her into the cubicle and tries to undress her? It's something we see a lot in many Asian dramas and so I have pondered over it and just wanted to share/discuss my opinion so feel free to disagree.
For me it is about a representation of a flawed character. And I am glad that not every hero is a saint because in this way I begin to relate to characters in a personal way. More than that it makes the characterization interesting in that I become invested in their downfall or development. That isn't to say that it doesn't make me uncomfortable because it does. Whenever I see such acts, I'm turned off but I go along with it for the sake of the story, to see where they are going to take the 'asshead' next because just like in real life, I like to know that people can always change for the better.
Of course there is the whole issue of romanticizing such acts so that impressionable people grow up thinking that violence can be legitimate foreplay. However there is a big difference between fiction and reality and as much as media glorifies violence at some point I need to take responsibility for my actions. I think dramas like these need an age limit or parental discretion and involvement so that younger audiences are made to realize that such behaviour is only interesting in fiction, where we might dissect the human psyche. *cough* Twilight *cough cough* Hehe. http://youtu.be/RZwM3GvaTRM
I also understand why people would hate the manner the scenes are romanticized and again I agree that it would be much preferable to have such scenes depicted more true to life than some sugar coated fairy tale versions which emotional music and soft lighting but that is really the director/writer/actor's artistic license to create art as they please. Just like computer games, action/horror movies aren't the cause of murders and violence in real life, so too I place such aspects of fiction. I'm not saying that they are not blameworthy but rather I say instead of trying to control art we should communicate more with people, especially families and the youth about both negative and positive issues art raises.
For me Secret Garden, especially Joo Won was problematic because he was far from any ideal but in that way I became interested and invested in his growth just like Daoming Si before and Darcy before that. Anyway, thanks for reading and feel free to disagree/debate.
I totally agree with you on pretty much everything you said. I actually tend to like the flawed characters more, a la Gaksital's Shunji, but it was pretty set there that he was the villain, and my appreciation for him was completely based on how well his characterization was done. When it's the hero behaving that way and it's not meant to be a 'bad thing,' I have issues. And I also was really bothered by those little things with Joo-won before (the forced kiss in whatever episode it was had me cringing). I realize that it's just meant to be entertainment so take what you will from that, but I do think that it's not something that I would want my little sister watching and possibly thinking "Oh, that's okay to do." It was a hilarious show, but that whole bit kinda marred it for me.
Uh-oh, when people start agreeing with me I get worried, hehe. Seriously though, I do understand the problem people have with such flawed characters and actions and I don't people from switching off and tuning out, like many did with Que Sera Sera AND furthermore I understand the problem with such romanticizing because you don't have to be young to be influenced. However I just don't think placing limits on art is the way forward because people themselves don't have limits. Though I would concede that with Secret Garden there really wasn't much redeeming on his part in terms of his manner and actions and towards the end his actions were only glamourized more and more. It's like, 'he's passionate! If you want passion you have got to take the good with the bad!' which I didn't like so much. I would have liked to have seen more change from his side in terms of the way he treated people, especially women.
I get that those little things add up so that in the end you just don't want to put any more time into such a repugnant human being. I guess I just like seeing the worst of people because like Frodo I need to see/know that they are able to find redemption.
I love growth/redemption in characters, especially when they're so flawed (and therefore real) at the start. My problem with Joo-won was that I didn't feel like he changed nearly enough, if even at all. He had a lot of potential for growth, but it never happened. In my opinion, he stayed the same immature, selfish person through the end of the series. This is a horrible comparison, but I think of Kang-to in Gaksital and how awful he was, but he became a "hero" despite the odds. Now that's a COMPLETELY different scenario, genre, character, and whatnot, but it's that character growth that I want in dramas...It's taken pretty lightly in the more rom-com stuff, but they have done it in a few that I can think of off the top of my head, so it is obviously possible in the more rom-com type dramas. I just wish we saw it more often.
I am not totally against the whole force-thing in shows, as long as it isn't portrayed in such a way as to make someone think that it's desirable. Rape, assault, all of that is a real part of life and cutting it out of media wouldn't be accurately portraying humanity. But painting it in a 'glamorous' light, to use your wording, is a big no-no in my opinion, because that isn't accurate either.
Your comparison with Kang-to isn't so different. His redemption was presented well. It wasn't just tacked on but you could see that inner struggle and though he eventually took the 'wrong' path, he took knowingly which is to say that he understood that what he did was wrong even if he justified it to himself. Now with the assheads of Kdramas winning their loves over only seems to vindicate their previous disgusting actions. Their struggles aren't about what is right or wrong but over giving up with hearts to a person. In ends justifies the means and everything is conveniently forgotten. However sometimes there is change, sometimes you see the little ways they realize that the struggle isn't an outside obstacle of their beloved's resistance but something within themselves. It's a blink and you will miss it thing and more than often I don't see people discussing it on forums but still I'll take what I can get considering that it is in the commercial domain.
It is true that we are harsher with indie projects because they should know better and much more lenient with commercial/mainstream stuff because well, we are just so happy that they did a little something right but that's a whole other debate. My point is that you can't expect 'radical' ideas at the forefront of mainstream fiction. AND yes! I too think it is sad that in the 21st century protesting against the way women are treated is still considered radical.
Love the flawed characters, if it's a flaw i can put up with for the sake of the story. Some flaws I just can't forgive. And there's often a communal agreement among the viewers as to what flaw we cannot forgive..even if the character is somewhat redeemed at the end. Although I like fierceness in a character -- especially if a character is a king-- I'm not a fan of the rape-violence scene that makes the woman suddenly love the guy. Or of the fierceness that is merely cruel. I tend to like self-involved characters but not insensitive ones -- a fine line between those two but we can usually tell.
Back in the day when I was deciding what genre I would write for, I realized how restricting/restrictive some publishers were. Especially the Christian publishers. Characters not to be on a bed together, even if they're married. No cursing/swearing. Characters not allowed to dance. (As the old Amish joke goes: Never have sex while standing, it can lead to dancing.) With that kind of stuff, one ends up with a great deal of human activity not being seen or even addressed. And stories become more instructive and preachy than real. Or the characters feel somewhat idealized. So I agree with everything what you say.
" communal agreement among the viewers as to what flaw we cannot forgive" Yes I see this too and it relates a lot to what people or the public are willing to forgive in reality too. For instance, I was discussing this with someone who disagrees with me and insists that there need to be limit/borders in everything for our own protection, and asked me what if the character went as far as rape. Would that be acceptable under artistic licence? I mean in MG or BOF the main lead organizes for the girl to be raped/assaulted, which is not far from that. For her it just is unacceptable depictions of actions that should be removed from society as well as our sight. However for me I'm all about the inner struggle. It doesn't matter if the person falls low as long as I can see redemption, remorse and eventually them making amends.
At the crux of this issue though isn't the depth of flawed personality but the depiction of their repulsive actions which are shown in an attractive/appealing way. I agree that though I don't want to limit artistic licence I don't like it. However unlike those who would protest such depictions by tuning out, I don't. I watch and see where the character is taken and developed. Let's say I am more forgiving of not just the characterization but the production crew because I am hopeful that both can redeem themselves. My friend sees this tolerance as detrimental as would those publishing houses you referred too and I would agree with them but the fact is we don't live in a utopia nor should we want some kind of Orwellian nightmare. I kind of work with what we have, where we are at right now and slowly inch towards betterment. Maybe it isn't the best way or the higher road like my friends but I believe it to be the more realistic.
It's like your case where you have two roads so to speak, and I don't think either one was wrong. Maybe one was better than the other but in truth both are striving towards the same goal: the understanding of the human soul/psyche and its development. I wish you well.
I love flawed characters (and Que Sera Sera will always be one of my favorite dramas). But I hated both Secret Garden and A Gentleman's Dignity for their treatment of their male leads—it's one thing for a show to acknowledge that a character is flawed and behaving inappropriately, but those shows didn't. They presented it as *romantic* when their male leads pinned women up against walls against their will, when really at best it was sexual harassment and at worst sexual violence.
There's an excellent post about this in relation to Coffee Prince over at Idle Revelry.
Thank you for that link, Llamaesque. I loved Coffee Prince, btw, and was not at all offended by that kiss for many of the reasons stated in that article. Same with Que Sera, Sera. I think I could accept it because it was such a raw, gritty drama from the get-go, and I think it was aimed at a whole different audience than typical drama fans. It was important to the storyline, and made the ending all the sweeter.
I do agree in both cases, the kisses elicited a necessary gut reaction. But to me they were't repulsive, just kind of "Whoa!" The reason I loved both dramas is because of the intense feelings they generated, whether good, bad or painful.
Secret Garden I liked because of the body switching parts and a few other scenes but really didn't care for either lead's character. Therefore, I just watched it on a shallow level and didn't get too worked up over it because I wasn't emotionally invested.
Thanks for the link, I will look into it.
I would say even QSS depicted impassioned actions as acceptable even foreplay however I do agree that there was actual redemption for the guy in that he changed not just how he dealt with the girl but all women. I also agree that with other dramas including SG it's just not there or is very insignificant; everything is made acceptable under the banner of 'true love.' This is why I would strongly encourage some kind of certification for such dramas because I just feel that you need mature minds that understand the bigger picture. I mean I watch because I love stories where the fallen rise from their ashes, so to speak but I know that for most this stuff is an ideal.
It worries me that a chunk of romantic fiction is about obsessive love but instead of just belittling people's feelings and telling them that their desires are strange or wrong, I would want to understand why. Why do women love watching/reading even writing about obsessive love? The fact is that this is the stuff that sells, it's commercial and mainstream. Though sometimes I see supply and demand like the chicken and the egg, with the amount of fanservice that goes on as well as the whole concept of live filming, I do believe that it is the demand end that needs more analysing that the supply part. I'm not saying that the dramas aren't blameworthy but rather that it is more important to look at why people love this kind of stuff. I'm just glad that sometimes we get redemption so that people might begin to see it as flawed as it is in reality.
you said: "Let’s say I am more forgiving of not just the characterization but the production crew because I am hopeful that both can redeem themselves"
SOOOOOOOOOOO true. And there is nothing more disheartening than to realize a production crew is totally clueless about how they are. Or are not so clueless perhaps but they totally disagree with what everyone else sees so clearly. It's like. "Oh, MR PD, you expect us all to go along with that????"
"..there’s often a communal agreement among the viewers as to what flaw we cannot forgive.."
While I think that is true to a large extent, my most hated drama of all time is "My Little Bride", where a 15 year old high school girl is forced into an arranged marriage. But it's all OK with many people I guess, as the show got fairly high ratings when it aired in 2004.
Aah, midterms, I know all about it (sadface)! Good luck studying!
I've never gotten around to finish SG. The constant bickering and arguing of the two leads got so annoying I couldn't stand it. And when I got news of 'the scene' I lost interest all together. Oska's character was really fun though!
And I don't want FBND to end! It's the only drama at the moment that I'm really watching with interest, I don't want to say goodbye to the characters already! And I agree with you about doubting Do-hwi's redeeming, I don't even know if it's possible at all, let alone in two episodes!
Have a nice Friday!
Hey Wanda, how have you been? FBND has been wonderful and yeah, I didn't marathon it as each week just had been wanting more! Anyway, just wanted to say hi and wish you well as always.
Sabah! : ) It's been a while! How are you?
I've returned to college (with a bit of a heavy heart I have to say), and busy studying again. Luckily it's weekend now so I can relax a little.
I knew it would be hard to wait till you could marathon it! Very understandable that in the end you didn't. What other dramas are you watching/enjoying these days?
Wishing you a great Friday and weekend!
I'm well. Don't worry you soon will find your stride again. It's always hard to adjust but I'm sure that you have already set new goals to keep you looking ahead to future joys and success!
Hehe, I really was kidding myself! I'm actually watching a lot right now! There's Ad genius and that winter...Also i started this wonderful drama from 2006 called Someday on the recommendation of a friend. It's style is quite different from mainstream Kdramas. Slow and wistful. I highly recommend it especially since you loved the other 'peculiar' Kdrama WC. I'm enjoying everything that I'm watching which either means everything is good or my standards have fallen. I leave it up to you to decide. hehe. How about you, did you manage to start L7? I watching Corner Gas and a character called someone L7 which stands for square because if you write 'L' and '7' on top of each other it makes a square...haha! I didn't know that, is that universal meaning? I mean is that what L7CS means too? Enjoy your weekend too!
I hope so...thanks for your positive words!
Someday sounds good! I will look into it as indeed I did love the other 'peculiar' drama as you said.
I did indeed start L7! I love your idea that it could stand for a square. I've never known that meaning either, but it's very interesting. Now when I read the title it looks like square civil servant! Watched the first two episodes. It wasn't as bad as I feared but nowhere near pretty good. It's that Joo Won is in it or I wouldn't really have the motivation to watch further. Though it's pretty light on the drama, that makes it a good drama to watch when you want something not too heavy.
That Winter, looks very interesting. But I'm not sure I'm up for another melo seeing as the last one (Nice Guy) was kinda traumatizing. Would you say it's as depressing as NG was? Or is it uncomparable?
What do you like about Ad-genius? I always love an underdog story, so the plot appealed to me.
Haha totally with you on not wanting to say goodbye to the characters...I will weep bitter tears when we leave Enrique behind. I totallly want one. And Dok-mi is so much like myself - it's so refreshing, because she's not a typical k-drama heroine! I'm really hoping that they move the Dong-hoon/editor noona story forward in the last two episodes, because that was a side story done right. They are so. Adorable.
Aah, I want an Enrique too! Were can I get one? Though his hyperactive behaviour might become irritating in real life, hehe.
Dok-mi's indeed a very refreshing character! Very nice to take a detour from the average candy-like typical heroine. She reminds me of myself too in certain extent, I like to hole up at home too (and watch dramas, hehe) with many layers of clothing and blankets.
And the editor is one of the most brilliant side characters ever! She's hilarious! I totally ship her and Dong-hoon together. Very adorable indeed.That moment when he had to pronounce Papua New Guinea was so funny!
Dok-mi is more like me than any drama heroine I've ever encountered, and even if I wasn't like her I'd still love her. And I want an Enrique too, how can anyone NOT want a hyper-speed vulnerable puppy on sugar like him? I wish it wasn't all ending next week, I love the little world of this show and would have liked to spend a little more time in it.
Anyone else digging iris2?
Flower boy next door
Level 7 civil servant
Substitute princess (Taiwanese)
Ad genius lee tae baek
Incarnation of money
Trying to finish ojakgyo bros.
Clearly i have no life.
Anyone else disturbed by the park si hoo debacle? Everything about it gives me the creeps.
I liked the kid actors in the first ep of Iris 2 (Kim So-hyun!!!) and really wanted to like it because Baek Sung-hyun is in it, but it was just too messy for me to get into.
I've been trying to finish Ojakkyo Brothers for over a month now, but other dramas just keep getting in the way.
(and Park Shi-hoo is in a scandal? I'm off to google, I had no idea)
Never mind I just googled and don't have the nerve to read the full story......if it is true, he has to get the punishment he deserves. If people can get prosecuted for past instances of drug use, I hope sexual assault is taken as seriously.
I agree! I have a hard time believing we're talking about PSH here! I haven't followed his career but this sounds like a huge blow!
Wow! ..... the Park Shi-hoo situation ..... I just found out now ...... *still processing the reported information* ..... this is not good for everybody involved
The most annoying thing is the netizen reaction. Since when is it ok to take villifying a potetional victim so far? It made my stomach all kinds of sick.
They've moved on from blaming her now that more information has come out. Sad they didn't wait for actual information before judging her. At first they only had the CCTV of the woman leaving the restaurant walking on her own, but now the police have CCTV of the rookie actor friend of PSH carrying the drunk woman on his back into PSH's apartment. Adding to that now the friend is also facing sexual assault charges. This whole thing is just sickening on so many levels. I just don't see how he's not guilty.
I am so sad to hear about the PSH situation. I am a huge fan of his and even own a shirt with his face on it so I was shocked to hear of the allegations. I am praying its not true but honestly don't know what to think. Eitherway its a really awful situation that is a blow to his fans.
The sad thing is there is not going to be any win in this situation, only lose-lose. Regardless of how it really happened, (and we'll never know) it feels like another case of alcohol destroying lives, unfortunately.
Alcohol is such a gray area. Drunk guys don't know when to stop and get confused about what it is the woman wants. Drunk girls don't remember what they agreed to do or what they did. I'm not one who immediately thinks an actor is innocent just because i like him, but I also don't believe the girl is some evil gold-digger and I am really weirded out by the fact that his fans are even saying how good it would be to be raped by him. It's like, really folks? Really?
I said this to someone last night...this would be my advice to any son looking to hook up:
No means no. Drunk/hi yes means no. Drunk/high/unconscious non-response is an assumed no. Sleeping is no. When she says no because she thinks it makes her look like a nice girl but she really means yes? It's a no.
When you get a no you either drop back to the last verbalized, sober yes...or you wait for another opportunity to ask. You will not die if you don't sleep with that girl. You might die if you do.
My advice to guys even simpler: instead of wondering about whether she said no, go by whether you've got a YES instead. Much less room for misunderstandings, and at least consent is pretty unambiguous if your partner's said it.
I agree. As long as your partner is not in any way impaired by drugs or alcohol. Then even a yes is a NO.
Wow...that advice covered a lot of ground! You're really thorough! But that's good advice though! Got to remember that if I ever have a son....
JoAnne, that is EXACTLY the right thing to teach. If there is any sort of impairment then it's an automatic NO. If No is said in any way, it means NO. Really unless you get an absolute YES from a sober, coherent partner then it's a NO.
@Carole - I remember, four years ago, Chris Brown's fans blowing up Twitter saying they wanted to be beaten by him - this is definitely a thing that cuts across countries, never underestimate the power of fans to make you despair for humanity :/
:sigh:: Yes, Pogo! I remember.
what a world!
JoAnne and Pogo...wise words, wise advice.
OMG! People are saying that?? What on earth is wrong with these people?! I can understand that you're a fan but some things are just wrong!
The Park Shi Hoo situation is disturbing on so many levels. I'm trying to reserve judgment until all the facts come out. But I will say that Park Shi Hoo showed a decided lack of good judgment no matter if the encounter turns out to be consentual or not. I could more easly excuse that from a 20 something year-old. But a man that's mid-30's (older then me) should know better then to put himself in that situation.
Really the whole thing is just sad and potentially desctructive for two young people's lives.
I wonder if this is at all related to his recent management change. (He went from a professional company to working with his brother, I think.) From what I've seen, managers are super hands on in Korea and essentially dictate every aspect of an artist's life. So now that he's free from that, is this an example of Park Shi Hoo being totally out of control because he's on his own?
Llamaesque, I thought the same thing. Some fans are saying that this is a set-up, a conspiracy by PSH's former management company. But in my opinion, it is more likely that for the first time in his adult life he is on his own, without a handler, forced to make his own spur-of-the-moment decisions and live with the consequences. For most people this happens when they leave home as a young adult, their parents' words of wisdom still ringing in their ears (thank you, JoAnne!), but in his case, here is a very high-profile individual in a position of power, with no one to check his actions. I don't know if he committed any sort of sexual assault or not - the courts get to decide that one - but it is obvious that he suffered from a severe lack of judgement.
And as the mother of girls, this is just one more example I put in front of my daughters as to what happens when you drink irresponsibly. Not that they don't get that info already; at my daughter's high school, they teach the girls how to guard a drink so no one can put a date-rape drug in it. It's a brave new world, all right.
I am not sure whether you can say Park Si-Hoo has suffered from severe lack of judgment. If what the test report revealed by Police is true, the incident is actually planned. In other words, knowingly, he and Mr. K individually or together has made a wilful act to harm Miss A, and their intention is fulfil his or their joint needs in Valentine's evening.
Can you call a supposing "romantic" wilful act a lack of jugement?