Wow thanks for the weecap @Saya and @Laica
1. I do understand what @Saya thinking about 'The MOM' cause I live in the society that close to how Jian's Mom believe. But I still can't accept those thinking about marriage is one of the way to make you and your status increasing. How parents thinks that the background family is anything for you to look success (and happy?). In the end I really dislike Jian's Mom.
2. Luckily, Jian's father and brother are open minded and can sympathy with JA and JH. As long as you get the support from on of your family, it will be different.
3. JH is hot temper and this will be advantage for both of them to stay together and facing JA's Mom
4. I think, KS just disappoint with them, cause they are the closest ont for her and yet they are not tell her about the relationship.

I fully agree with "no more realism, I just want to watch a romance!". I like the romance as well as the realism in this drama but the romance is just wow.

I don’t know. I might not be in a majority here but I somehow feel like the romance is quite .. hmm too much? I don’t know. Haven’t been in a relationship for a long time so I can’t connect to that feeling of being infatuated by love that much. I somehow think that the relationship dominated by feeling alone is likely to be doomed at the end.. dunno. Let’s hope it’s not gonna be like that. I also think that the plot should make the leads more reasonable. Haha.. if any beanie can not comprehend my point of view, I’m an ISTP. I think that can answer all the questions. 😌

I agree with an opinion here too that the way Joon hee seems to be paternalistic is because he’s trying, unintentionally, to narrow the age gap. He is much younger in the relationship, yet this is a relationship established in a very conservative part of the world, where men are supposed to take care of the household and women nurturing the family. What kinda makes me a feel a bit uncomfortable is the way Jin ah treated Joon hee. Sometimes she is very sweet to the point that I’m not sure whether she acts more immature than she really is (perhaps to make Joon her feels more confident, domineering.) But there are also many times when she acts like his mother or Noona. Many decisions should be made together or things done together like telling their close ones about their relationship, yet she always says, perhaps ‘offers’ is a more suitable word, to do it alone. It doesn’t make sense to me, so Jin ah comes of as being self-centered and very immature in thr relationship.

I don’t know. Perhaps this is the result of lacking appropriate love and understanding from her mother which made her this way. She lacked self respect and could not stand up for herself, which I’m not sure whether this can be made better by receiving so much love from Joon hee alone.

What in the fuck? Kyu Min tries to kill her, and NOTHING happens to him? He doesn't get arrested? She doesn't get a restraining order? Then she sees him AGAIN the next day?

I have to keep reminding myself not to victim blame, but Jin Ah is So. Stupid. She brings it upon herself. She is the stereotypical damsel in distress who always needs her boyfriend to save her. She almost got raped and killed, then acts cute like nothing happened.

I know it's not her fault her ex-boyfriend is a psycho because it could happen to anyone, and I commend her good mentality for quickly forgetting the bad things that happen to her, but she is a bloody idiot. Though I never believed Kyu Min would actually kill Jin Ah; he's too much of a coward to take his own life.

How do her parents and brother not hear Jin Ah's lovey-dovey phone calls with Joon Hee? Does her room have soundproof doors? My doors are paper-thin.

Seung Chul's drunken Congratulations was the highlight of today's episode. Thank you, Jin Ah, for stealing that tambourine from the noraebang. And thank you, @Laica and @Saya, for your commentary!

i just want to comment about the mom's differing attitudes toward her daughter and son. asian moms have a cultural gene that prevents them from crediting their daughters' intelligence and capability - wait, i think it's that cultural gene's fault that mothers will focus their hopes and dreams upon their prodigal sons, rather than notice, acknowledge or encourage those of their daughters...

i joke, of course. but hey, it's REAL. the sons get the praise, the daughters get the criticism... as your asian sisters/friends. in my generation, my asian girlfriends had to pay their own way thru college while their brothers got support from the parents. i'm talking about here in the US... so imagine what it's like in asia.

the mother isn't "mean" or "cruel" - she's a korean/asian mother, period. it's cultural, it isn't shocking to hear the way she talks in korea or even for those of us who've had to deal with those issues from our own mothers (immigrant or american-born) here in the states. it is a lingering cultural norm that - at least among my generation of asian american women - we hope to dispense of as we raise our own children. it is getting more diffuse here, but it is not changing much in the native asian countries.

just had to toss that in, so you can try to not hate the mother based upon your own cultural upbringing...

So, Episodes 7-8, not the strongest. Are there not restraining orders in Korea? But Joon-her overcome with emotion from the recording and then driving her home from the hospital was enough to make me forgive the rest. And I started ep 9. Still so good. I LIVE FOR THIS OTP TO BE ON SCREEN TOGETHER!

Thanks for the recaps.

Long post for discussion purposes:

The "realism" of the story is very good, but the relationship seems stalling at this point.

In what direction is the relationship moving? There needs to be some core conflict between the couple beyond JA mother’s objections or an “us against the world” relationship bond. The story needs to have a moment which puts the relationship in serious risk. Here is my suggestion: JA and JH have a major conflict involving trust.

Example, if JH goes to China (expected because of the Korean economy, gaming industry hard field to enter, etc.), we’d expect JA to “surprise” visit him.

A plot twist would be that JA surprises JH who is comforting a drunk, Chinese female co-worker. He would say that there is nothing going on - - - just helping a colleague going through a bad time. But in reality, the Chinese female worker has been harassing JH for his attention and affection. (An ironic change from the coffee company subplot).

At JH’s place, as our couple gets playful, JA finds a bra. JH jokes is that hers? It sets up the bad assumption-denial couple story. JA accuses him of infidelity in their relationship; he tries to calm her down with a story about his colleague being too drunk to go home (and he could not read Chinese to find her address) so she crashed at his place - - - - but nothing went on. JA feels she is suddenly back with her pyscho ex-bf.

Flashback to JH talking to JA’s brother about his playboy days. JA assumes the worst and storms out. This gives the couple a real issue: mistrust.

How would JA handle such a (perceived) betrayal?
How could JH redeem himself?

I would presume that JA would delete their past and block him on her phone because she has been crushed by JH. JH would have to find another way to get her back.
I would presume JH would try to resign to go back to Korea to patch things up, but his bosses would threaten him with no employment in the industry if he left them at a critical product development point. Or his sister would tell him not to because he would be both miserable and unemployed with no prospects for recover from either setback. She could offer to mediate between the couple, but her own view could further sabotage their relationship.

JA would return home to make a critical examination of her life. She would resign from the coffee company to the dismay of the director. She would move out of her mother’s domineering house to another city like Busan, to become a coffee shop manager in a tourist area. This would give her a taste of real independence.

Since viewers have speculated that the story seems to be set in 2015, the ending could drift to present 2018, three years later after the “break up” incident. We could see JA managing her own shop when a middle age man comes in to order. There is some small talk, and the man says he needs to come in more often if JA is around. JA could have found the courage to be a more forceful self by...

@laica, you spoke my truth. I find him super paternalistic and the way she kept apologizing to him about her ex being a psycho made me itch. Should she have had her guard up around her ex? Yes, absolutely. However, apologies were unwarranted and unnecessary. That particular piece of writing loss me some of my goodwill toward the show. I still like it, but don't love it as much anymore.

'I wish the impulse to protect herself, and stand up for herself, came from her own self-worth and not so that he would feel reassured and happy'
PREACHH! JinA seriously has a very low self-esteem. She needs to love herself a bit more because she is a fantastic person. I hate that she said she wanted to change how she is because of a man because it is very demeaning to hear that as a woman. Hopefully, she will realise that in the future.

The whole thing about Jin-ah and her cellphone issue it's so odd to me, so okay, she wanted to keep her number and had to ask her ex for a favor BUT the same ex who tried to rape her and it's constantly stalking her, she could at least call her friend to go with her (maybe she didn't tell Kyung-sun because she knew she would tell Joon-hee) or her brother i don't know, but anyone it's better than getting in his car alone. Thank god nothing happened and i hope she learned from this.

I'm so glad I watched 7 and 8 back-to back. I wasn't sure if i should be scared, mad, or annoyed that she got into the car with her ex.

I understand that she thought nothing would happen but couldn't she meet him at the phone store.

I have to vent, phone companies are the worst. My sister and mom can't even make changes to our phone plan because the plan is under my name. Even though we are all adults.

I am trying hard to see that mum’s behaviour is product of culture but it is difficult for me. I can’t help but see that it has a lot to do with her as a person. I am Asian living in Asia. Seen my fare share of mums prefering their sons to their daughters. But to give no voice to her daughter is difficult for me to stomach. I argue that that is the primary reason why Jin Ah made terrible decisions. That is also the reason why she stomached all the abuse in office. If her mum (a person whom she is supposed to get a glimpse of her self worth from) is telling her what to do, how to think, to deny her gut-level feelings of danger and except GM again cos couples do quarrel... belittling her, calling her unkind names...how is she going to learn to see herself as worthwhile.
Although JH came off as paternalistic earlier on, he learnt to let go and let her take the lead. I argue that she needed to do that to grow. She needed to learn to stick to her preference no matter how uncomfortable the process. With JH giving her the support, not belittling her even when she made mistakes, she will see herself as worthwhile.

Episode seven had me pumping my fist with joy when Jin-ah's father said he was supportive of their relationship. I'm glad that he worked out that Kyu-min isn't the nice guy they thought he was and wouldn't give him the satisfaction of being shocked.

That 2 drops of tears reflecting in Joon he’s eyes.... best realization ever....

Thanks @laica and @saya for this again

Is no one going to talk about that tasteful intimate scene at the hospital where JH helped JA change?

Ok, first things first. Thank you both for the awesome recap. I'm actually liking this format more than I thought I would. Reading the two of you talk about your difference of opinion is quite satisfying especially since I see myself being of the same mind with one, and I get to see the opposing view of the other play out. Something similar happens in the comments section here, but with you two, it seems like a podcast. Oh, it would be so awesome if we had podcast recaps. Anyways...

Ok, let's talk about the Jin-ah's mother first. @Saya stated, there are people who can and/or choose to change, and there are those who can't and/or refuse to change. I also agree that we are the products of society. The culture, norms, agents of socialization etc. we are surrounded by shape our beliefs. However, as @Laica stated, personality is a totally different thing. Take Jin-ah's father for example. He is a product of the same society that Jin-ah's mother is--granted, as a man he may not have had the same experiences she did--however, his personality allows him to be far more caring and openminded compared to his wife. There are many times when I found Jin-ah's mom berating and disparaging. I mean, if you can tell your own daughter that she should take back a man who cheated on you and even worse in the way she did, how is that not disparaging. There are times when one needs to realize that something is wrong or something needs to change. This often happens when that individual is impacted by it directly. It is for this reason why I'm giving Jin-ah's a ton of leeway. As much as I dislike her already, I am willing to give her the benefit of the doubt be seeing not only how she reacts to the news, but also if there is any change in the short term. Unfortunately, in real life, it can take people years if not an entire lifetime to finally come around--if they ever do in the end. This is a drama though, and I'm not exactly waiting for ep. 16 for her to finally turn around.

I would love to talk about how silly the ending of the car ride back from the hospital was. I mean, all she had to do was say that she told her parents she wasn't coming home that night to diffuse the situation. I mean, yeah, he gets to be with her, but come on. I could see the real life aspect of this conversation, but it was just too stupid for my tastes.

but I wish the impulse to protect herself, and stand up for herself, came from her own self-worth and not so that he would feel reassured and happy.

I have to agree with @saya on this. I definitely see where @laica is coming from, but sometimes the catalyst for change does not always come form within, but from other sources and I don't think, in this case, that's a problem. TBH, I've seen this imbalance in a few of relationships around me and none have resulted in a split yet. lol. I can't believe I'm saying this, but I actually find it refreshing compared to the usual K-drama fare.

I honestly think Jin Ah is somewhat naive? She does do dumb things like get into the car of an ex already proven to be violent towards her. But I also feel like she is not very mature when it comes to relationships. I feel like she is a teenager in her outlook. Like telling Jun Hee that 'everyone does it' about making joint bank accounts etc. Like she has an idealistic/unrealistic picture of what dating is supposed to be. Maybe that's why she had supposedly dated so many losers.

Honestly I almost stopped watching from the very first episode when she went out to buy those expensive clothes and shows for that meeting with Gyu Min - I absolutely don't like those kinds of characters. Jin Ah is so intelligent and capable at work though. And I don't think she is standing up for herself at work because of Jun Hee at all. Her backbone started growing before they were officially in a relationship.

As for Jun Hee being paternalistic/controlling, I don't think so at all. And if I was in his position with a partner like Jin Ah I would also feel the need to be overly protective. Nothing that he has done has been in a normal context. Everything was a reaction to the extreme situations that she has been in with Gyu Min. The one exception is perhaps the whole incident with the flowers. That reaction was violent I admit and I make no excuses for him. But again, I can't say I wouldn't do the same in that situation.

Jin Ah and Jun Hee's relationship seems too much like a fairy tale to me right now. I really don't like the choice by the director to have a lot of scenes of them frolicking to background music. I want tangible, real relationship development. More talks and interactions like the one they had after the hospital. I guess that's too realistic though.

aaahh I have stuff I want to say (lots of stuff!) but I'm pathetically exhausted XD

I don't know, I don't think the Mom's excusable by generation or by culture and people like her character need to stop being given that "crutch". My parents are of the Mom's generation and from Taiwan and when my mom was in a similar relationship to Jian's and her ex my grandparents fully supported her decision to get out of that relationship regardless of how rich the family was because they saw how miserable she was. Respect for people you love is respect at any time period, and I don't think Jian's mom respects her daughter at all. I feel like she looks down on her in comparison her son, whether it be for the typical sexist reasons, or because Seungho's moving up in the world in her eyes by getting a Ph. D. She doesn't respect anyone really, unless they have status. In her conversation with Joonhee and his sister at dinner earlier, she basically insults them for not having parents and acts like she doesn't have a clue what's so wrong about what she said. She seems very materialistic and foolish from what I've seen, using the guise of concern for her daughter's wellbeing to mask the fact that she's status hungry. Like that's the only reason I could find for why she's clinging onto Jian's ex, because is she wasn't then she'd just tell Jian to marry just anyone. Unless they spin her materialism as fear (which I doubt due to her fixation on Jian's ex), I don't think I'm going to be able to come around on her.

That being said, she's a very real character because I have met various people with bits and pieces of her personality, but it's still not ok.

He is being paternalistic by seeing and telling her that she gets into trouble when alone? Well, he is absolutely right. She has done a number of very foolish things, mostly with her ex. She went to confront and beat him up and ended up at the police station, she secretly went for a ride with him in the car risking her life and ended up at the hospital. I mean... this girl often seems to have the brains of a chicken!
He is too good not to confront her more angrily. Instead, after the car crash incident, instead of scolding her, he was silent and supportive, he even teared up saying "It's my fault, I should have insisted on buying you a phone". If it were me, maybe not that same moment, but the next moment, when she was calmed down from the shock, I'd let her hear a bit of my mind.
This girl is so immature and he is much more mature than she is. That's how the age gap is compensated.
I remember "Secret Love Affair". Although the woman there was smooth and capable, still she was very fragile inside and the younger guy was a force of nature, her pillar of strength where she could lean on.
The mother? No, sorry, she's a villain all right, just like the mom in "Temperature of Love". The father comes from the same society, the same generation, still he is much more human.

Just wanted to say that I love that it only took about 4 episodes for them to get together , its fresh of air because I feel like in most k-dramas it takes about 10 episodes or so for the leads to become a couple. Joon Hee and Jin Ah are not some teenagers or very young adults that is like ”Omg i like him/ her?? No way i wont admit that to even myself !” for so many episodes, until they finally admit it to themselves, and Then try to get the courage yo confess, until FINALLY after when the drama is soon almost finished they start a relationship.. Theyre not that childish that goes around being too stubborn. I Dont feel like their relationship was rushed at all, because they already knew each other for a long time .. and i believe Joon Hee has had a crush on Jin Ah for a very long time (which Ofc has now developed to LOVE). And when Joon Hee has been in US for 3 years and comes back, she sees him differently.. how manly he become etc .she saw him in new light.. I Dont think she would have ever fallen in love with him if he never had been abroard for so long.

JA needs to learn to trust JH more. The whole phone debacle showed that she is not ready to ask him for help when the issues are complicated. I think after the near death experience she realised that he can help and that she needs to share the important things and not just what she thinks couple should share (just because everybody else does it). Her dad was cool with MK...is he actually drinking so much because he knows his wife will try to mess the relationship up or is he disappointed? I honestly think he is happy for them so I did not understand why he drunk so much.

aren't we being almost "too sensitive" about JH's interactions with JA?
Is telling someone to be careful "paternalistic"?
Does "you should listen to me" really a paternalistic statement, or rather just a sign of worry that anyone, regardless of gender, would say?
Is thinking that your way of doing things might be better (given a certain situation) really a gender thing or can we agree that everyone can act this way?

as for JA loving herself more now that she's with JH, I interpreted it the same as @saya : sometimes, it takes an external force for you to realize just how precious you are. If you have always being treated like a doormat and then meet someone who treats you like a princess, it should make any reasonable woman rethink how she values herself. her self-worth is not really based on how he sees her but maybe it was the trigger that got her remembering the inner queen that she is, deserving of being treated well, to be respected and loved by her man and peers. She isn't just "grateful" for JH's love; she now understands that she DESERVES to be loved respectfully. the positive influence of his love and care for her turned off the doormat switch and gave her the boost of confidence she needed to navigate her world with a more assertive attitude.

Will she crumble back to her doormat ways if JH mysteriously becomes the Jerk of the Century? I don't think so. for once-worn-out-doormat-yet-intelligent women like JA, once the Inner Queen switch is turned on, there's no going back.

I've got to admit, the brother's reasoning for being against the pairing is pretty convincing. The odds that the relationship will eventually burn-out and leave Joon-hee ostracized from the only family he's ever known is pretty high. Especially considering Jin-ah's own flashes of doubt over the relationship. Joon-hee just wanted to date normally, Jin-ah wanted everything hidden. Joon-hee definitely has the most to lose. He's even risking his job for her.